<div>All very anti-fun :(</div>
<div> </div>
<div>But I have to agree on putting it in the same category, sort of: if my dog (I dont' actually have one, but if I did) fouled the pavement, and then I picked it upa nd removed it, that would be ok. The same should apply to bbqs.</div>
<div> </div>
<div>Ian<br><br></div>
<div class="gmail_quote">On 21 April 2010 12:06, jean perraton <span dir="ltr"><<a href="mailto:jean@perraton.myzen.co.uk">jean@perraton.myzen.co.uk</a>></span> wrote:<br>
<blockquote style="BORDER-LEFT: #ccc 1px solid; MARGIN: 0px 0px 0px 0.8ex; PADDING-LEFT: 1ex" class="gmail_quote">Peter writes 'I do not think it will be<br>a great sacrifice for anyone if the greens become smoke free and litter free.'<br>
<br>Yes. We should be seeking to encourage those activities which cause little nuisance for other park users and little harm to the environment - local and global. You could put having BBQs - with their smell and smoke as well as concerns about the source of their fuel and throw-away packaging - in the same category as dropping litter or allowing your dog to foul the footpaths.<br>
<br>That would be my starting point - but obviously how best to control is another matter.<br><br>Jean<br>----- Original Message ----- From: "peter constable" <<a href="mailto:p.constable@ntlworld.com" target="_blank">p.constable@ntlworld.com</a>><br>
To: "SOS Cambridge discussion list" <<a href="mailto:discuss@soscambridge.org.uk" target="_blank">discuss@soscambridge.org.uk</a>><br>Sent: Monday, April 19, 2010 7:00 PM
<div>
<div></div>
<div class="h5"><br>Subject: Re: [Discuss] Greens in central Cambridge Litter and Barbecues<br><br><br>
<blockquote style="BORDER-LEFT: #ccc 1px solid; MARGIN: 0px 0px 0px 0.8ex; PADDING-LEFT: 1ex" class="gmail_quote">Alan<br><br>This is an old subject and for years we have been trying to encourage<br>the Council to do something.<br>
There has been great resistance to notices but now there seems to be a<br>change of heart. It is difficult to consider taking action when<br>you have done nothing to bring the local ordinances to peoples<br>attention, There are ordinances against litter and fires.<br>
I must say that in the past I have leaned towards a barbecue area. In<br>the States this is normal in State Parks but I have never seen one<br>in a central city park. I have now come to the conclusion that a<br>barbecue area on Parkers Piece, Midsummer Common, Christ's Pieces,<br>
Jesus Green etc would be inappropriate. There is almost nowhere one<br>could be placed without it being obtrusive and polluting.<br><br>I very much appreciate your comments about people without gardens or<br>with very small gardens (I am one) but of course there are many<br>
thousands<br>of these dwellings in Cambridge and many thousands of students to whom<br>this would apply. There are also many thousands of residents and<br>visitors<br>who regularly visit our green spaces and who would prefer that smoke<br>
did not get in their eyes.<br><br>In the past it was not thought necessary to cook outdoors to enjoy a<br>picnic. The habit has grown only in recent years and has been<br>encouraged by<br>the supermarkets whose colorful bags are so liberally distributed<br>
around our greens. With the greatest respect I do not think it will be<br>a great<br>sacrifice for anyone if the greens become smoke free and litter free.<br><br>Yrs<br>Peter<br>Chair JGA<br><br><br>On 19 Apr 2010, at 15:41, Allan Brigham wrote:<br>
<br>
<blockquote style="BORDER-LEFT: #ccc 1px solid; MARGIN: 0px 0px 0px 0.8ex; PADDING-LEFT: 1ex" class="gmail_quote">Thanks John. But I suspect many of those having barbeques on parks<br>live in<br>bedsits or flats, with at the most balconies if they are lucky.<br>
<br>Some of the money from building new flats and especially small<br>bedsit type<br>developments goes into improving local parks for these residents just<br>because these new developments have no open space. There have been<br>
barbeques<br>on Romsey Rec over the last couple of years, and it makes a horrible<br>mess.<br>But I'm fairly sure that many of these are people who have no where<br>else to<br>go outside. Which doesn't mean that burning the turf, leaving litter<br>
or late<br>night noise is acceptable. But if policy is to encourage everyone to<br>live in<br>towns then there does need to be space for activities like barbeques.<br><br>Perhaps the issue is that of conflicting usages of open spaces, and<br>
how to<br>manage/reconcile these ?<br><br>And maybe developers should be encouraged to create barbeque<br>provision in<br>their developments.<br><br>Allan<br><br>-----Original Message-----<br>From: <a href="mailto:discuss-bounces@soscambridge.org.uk" target="_blank">discuss-bounces@soscambridge.org.uk</a><br>
[mailto:<a href="mailto:discuss-bounces@soscambridge.org.uk" target="_blank">discuss-bounces@soscambridge.org.uk</a>] On Behalf Of John Lawton<br>Sent: 19 April 2010 14:07<br>To: SOS Cambridge discussion list<br>Subject: Re: [Discuss] Greens in central Cambridge Litter and<br>
Barbecues<br><br>At 13:36 19/04/2010, you wrote:<br>
<blockquote style="BORDER-LEFT: #ccc 1px solid; MARGIN: 0px 0px 0px 0.8ex; PADDING-LEFT: 1ex" class="gmail_quote">Does SOS have a policy on barbeques ? Are the objections to<br>barbeques objections to burnt turf, or also to large gatherings,<br>
especially at night in summer ?<br></blockquote><br>I would say that we would oppose on the grounds that there is damage,<br>but also usually a huge amount of litter. Those who enjoy the fires<br>seem to feel free to make a huge mess and show no responsibility to<br>
clear up afterwards.<br><br>
<blockquote style="BORDER-LEFT: #ccc 1px solid; MARGIN: 0px 0px 0px 0.8ex; PADDING-LEFT: 1ex" class="gmail_quote">In America many open spaces come with barbeque provision. Do we need<br>the same here ?<br></blockquote><br>
Perhaps in the right setting, but I think not on grazing land, and<br>not if they harm the nature of the green space.<br><br>
<blockquote style="BORDER-LEFT: #ccc 1px solid; MARGIN: 0px 0px 0px 0.8ex; PADDING-LEFT: 1ex" class="gmail_quote">Maybe we need to think about parks differently as more and more<br>people are encouraged to live in high density developments with<br>
little private open space, so no room for barbeques at home. If the<br>numbers using parks increase then noise at all times of day from<br>parks becomes a bigger issue, so maybe existing parks need<br>redesigning to keep crowds away from houses ? Maybe we need more<br>
open spaces ?<br></blockquote><br>Agreed about more green space provision, but surely everyone has<br>room for a BBQ, if not a bonfire?<br><br>John<br><br><br>_______________________________________________<br>discuss mailing list<br>
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